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Going direct and fighting for your reputation -- with Anduril founder Palmer Luckey

中级 ⏱ 48:30

Palmer breaks down his approach to founder-led communications: reclaiming his reputation, when to fight back, and how to build a cult following

字幕文本（200 句）

By the way, you look like you're in
0:01
Guantanamo. What is this video camera?
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>> It's a laptop camera.
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>> Do me a favor and just like wipe the
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>> I don't think it's smudgy. I think it's
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actually just a very low resolution
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camera.
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>> You do look like a like a a weapon
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stealer. So great.
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>> So I remember Grim texting me. You were
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at all in and he was like, "You're going
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to want to see this."
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>> I talked earlier about NPC thinking that
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prioritizes popularity over principles.
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What I'm about to do is in very, very
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bad taste, but I'm going to do it
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anyway. One of the people who I think
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embodies this type of NPC thinking is
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Jason Calennis.
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>> And it turned out to be this talk that
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broke the internet and everybody had
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seen it. Not a lot of people know about
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what went into it and the why. I I think
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a lot of people think of it as like a
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big mimemetic moment. But why did you
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decide to do this? What was the
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background? Like how did you plan for
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it? Well, you know, I mean, the
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background for people who who don't know
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is Jason had really gone after me very
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aggressively when it came out that I had
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given money to a proTrump group that ran
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the anti-Hillary Clinton billboard. And
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that's all they did. And he was so
1:00
aggressive about not just criticizing
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what I was doing, but specifically that
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the outcome that should take place as a
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result of me voting for the party that
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everyone voted for is that I should be
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fired and removed from my own company
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that I started as a teenager. It's some
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of the most anti-founder behavior I've
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seen and he consistently engaged in that
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behavior. He's not the only one. There
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are others. I never did anything about
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it. I just said, "Man, that Jason guy's
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a real shithead." Never said anything
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about it. I took the high ground for a
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pretty long time. Uh and then there's a
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few reasons that I decided that I was
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going to go after him. The first is I
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developed a worldview over the course of
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years that the world is better when
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everyone has teeth and everyone has
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claws and everyone knows it. It's the
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armed society is polite society argument
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as applied to industry reputation. Uh
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it's good for people to know that there
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are consequences for lying about people,
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especially if you're going to
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aggressively advocate for them to be
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fired. And then specifically celebrate
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on your podcast when they are fired and
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say it's the smartest decision Mark
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Zuckerberg has made all year. Like if
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you're if you're going to do that, be
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careful.
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>> Yes. But then so you decide to actually
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show up.
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>> So here's what happened. Uh, you know, I
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I didn't I I didn't see I didn't see
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Jason for years. And then um he reached
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out about five years into Anderal and he
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said, "Hey, Palmer, we'd love to have
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you on the pod." He he sent me this
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email and I gave him a very honest
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answer. I said, "I'm not going to be on
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your podcast. Why would I promote or
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help someone who lies about me and
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misleads his viewers and has also just
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generally been very hateful to me?"
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>> Now, this was just a direct reply. Yeah,
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this was just just to him. Another two
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years pass or so and I get invited to
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All-In Summit. He sends me these emails,
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Palmer, we've got to have you at All-In
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Summit. It's going to be amazing. We're
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going to have all the best entrepreneurs
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here. And I thought about this and and
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honestly, I wasn't going to do this
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whole stunt. Like, I wasn't planning on
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calling him out. I said, you know, I
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should probably be the bigger man. I
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should I should probably go to this
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summit. There are a lot of people there.
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Elon's even speaking at allin. I should
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go and use this as an opportunity to
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propagandize my much more important
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mission which is that people can't wait
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like the the title of my talk I gave was
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current year is too late to start caring
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about current things and I said you know
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I'm going to go there and talk about why
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you can't wait till after the war in
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Ukraine starts to care about national
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security that that means you'll
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necessarily never be part of deterring a
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problem only fixing it reactively people
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say they want to be a proactive and not
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reactive but that isn't how anyone
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online acts and so uh I did that He his
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team sets up a prep call for us to go
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over this and I planned on bringing up
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like, "Hey, Jason, just so you know,
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you've been a real shithead." And I was
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going to bring it up, work through it.
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Um, so they set up a Zoom. I go onto the
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Zoom. His team is there. Jason doesn't
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show up. No explanation, doesn't say
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anything, just doesn't show up. And so
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we just sat there.
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>> Was he supposed to be there?
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>> Oh, yeah. It was a prep call for me and
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him because he wanted me to give a talk.
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And then he wanted to do a Q&A at the
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end moderated by him. So, we're just
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sitting there on the line for 30 minutes
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and they said, "Well, I guess Jason's
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not going to show up, so we'll let us
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reschedu this." And so, uh, I of course
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now I had to give him [ __ ] about this.
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And so, they reschedule it for about two
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weeks later, right before the
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conference. And guess what? He doesn't
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show up again. Twice he bails. No
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explanation. And honestly, I know I know
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these other things I've talked about are
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a lot more high-minded. Sometimes the
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high-minded stuff uh the the straw that
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really broke the camel's back in this
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case was just the disrespect of not
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showing up. I said, "You know what?
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Screw this guy. What was I thinking?"
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>> Why didn't you just say no and pull out
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of the conference? Like what made you do
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this instead of just pulling out, which
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is what most people do?
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>> There's two reasons. One is the classic
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way that people model thinking about
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like basically going after people who
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attack you, whether they're successful
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in attacking RPG or not. They say,
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"Well, just ignore them. Just let them
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go." And this is it's horrible advice.
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It is good advice for almost nobody.
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Maybe like Jesus Christ or the Pope can
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afford this strategy. Um, but in
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reality, your ability to affect the
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world, to bring things into being, to
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convince people to work with you, work
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for you, and for investors to invest
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with you and for you is based deeply in
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your reputation.
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And if you don't care about what people
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think about you, you will necessarily
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accomplish less, work with fewer people,
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raise less money, and it's not a
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sliding, it's not like a binary thing.
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It's not you'll fail or you'll succeed,
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but even reputational drag can drag you
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further down the curve, and most people
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cannot afford that. So that that advice
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is is just terrible. So yeah, everyone
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says, "Palmer, just let it go." I said,
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"Well, first of all, I can't really
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afford to just let things like this go."
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like I I could be successful. It is
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valuable for me to go out there and
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correct the record on this stuff. But
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the bigger point, and this is the real
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reason, and I talked about it in my
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talk, most people don't have the ability
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to hit back at bullies like Jason.
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They're never going to get to be on
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stage at his own conference in front of
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his own psychopants explaining why they
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are all a bunch of NPCs following the
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NPC king. And I think that it's valuable
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to shock those people out of the matrix
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a little bit and to do it on behalf of a
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lot of the people who who who cannot do
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it. By the way, I had over a dozen
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founders that Jason had specifically
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gone after and either called for them to
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be fired or celebrated their firings
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reach out and say, "Palmer, what you did
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has really helped me because all of
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these like Jason's drugged me through
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the dirt and now people are realizing
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that Jason was wrong in doing that and

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